Bruno de Carvalho - Presidente do Sporting Clube de Portugal

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Querem apostar que a assembleia vai ser por voto digital?
Sinto-me na obrigação de vir a público dizer que enfiar uma lanterna no cú não torna ninguém num iluminado. E sim, sou formado em Luminotecnia.
não vejo qual o problema

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Sempre Sporting!
não vejo qual o problema

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Não? Vide assembleias do Venfique. Voto electrónico é mais facilmente manipulável que braco no ar
Sinto-me na obrigação de vir a público dizer que enfiar uma lanterna no cú não torna ninguém num iluminado. E sim, sou formado em Luminotecnia.
O fim do clube é um perigo eminente, as rescisões dos jogadores serão uma migalha em comparação com o abandono de sócios e adeptos que não irão sentir qualquer ligação afectiva ao Sporting se deixarem o Sporting ser tomado de assalto.
A lot of crap because if he loved Sporting he would already have stepped down.  The last month he said so many bullshit that somebody with a just a little bit of IQ doesn't believe him anymore.   Now it's just keeping on so that he can get his monthy income.   From zero to hero and back to zero that is his story at Sporting. Did I see this coming before 2018 no but now this is a reality. He was one of the best presidents until 2018 we had but know he is in contention with godinho Flopes to be one of the worst presidents in our history.  For me he became a Roquete someone who is there for his ego and the financial or other advantages  the presidency gives him.


You can translate my comment better, what you write is your opinion and probably what you see and read on TVs. I do not have that opinion and I do not usually classify people just by appearances, the President only did what he did because the Football team did not meet his demands (and many members of a team that is very well paid), is simple. If you had more inside what is happening in Portugal and in our country maybe you had another idea and position in the matter.
BTW, I do not usually measure a person's IQ just because they support an ideology or not.

Cheers.

I see someone who doesn't accept democratic instances, how could a judge rule that the mother is better for his child then the father;

I see someone who lies a lot of the time; Os socios criam que eu apagava o facebook, where is diana, there is no problem betweem the players and me;

I see someone who tells what people want to hear and excludes what the people don't want to hear; we loaned Jonathan Silva to Rome with a buy clause but he didn't say that the buy clause was optional; 90% voted for him in February, no 90% voted for the change of statutes and probably a lot but surely not 90% voted because they wanted him to stay.

I see someone who can't lead with his staff; how many people of his team left;

I see someone who needs to be in the point of attention; birth of his child, apparently his wedding; the way he talks always eu; the way he celebrates the wins instead of giving the staff and the players their moment of glory.

I see someone who can't deal with failure.

I see someone who doesn't respect anyone because if someone doesn't respect him then he will give him a name. Traidor, Ingrato, Sportinguado, Roquete, ....

I see someone who is too emotional.

I see someone who isn't capable to solve the problems internaly like smart people do or families normally do.

I see someone who is putting himself always in the victim role.


So he is incapable of being a good leader but soon or late this would come out like it did the past months.  Gestao Danosa, living in a fantasy world, disastrous communication and putting his interest above those of Sporting.


People that don't see that are in my opinion :

* idiots;
* idolize him;
* cowards;
* no Sportinguistas;
* or just there for the tacho like those who are still in the CD.

Our president has also good qualities and probably the best one he has is that he could convince people and he did that, he gave us back hope. I don't want someone of the old dinasty but I'm surely don't want him in a role where he can manage the day of day of Sporting.

This is a very good analysis. I agree with it. Thank you.
But let me try to express my opinion about the reasons why many are what you call "cowards". There are profound cultural aspects that you have to take into account.
Many Portuguese still have a trauma, coming from the times of dictatorship, of resignation and mistrust of the elites. They were right to feel that way. Power was controlled by a small group that kept most of the richness to themselves. This group was very closed and common people had very small chances of getting in. Even in the private sector, you only had a chance if accepted by this group (google "condicionamento industrial" for more detail).
Sporting kept this kind of situation after the revolution. It was like a reality that survived the revolution. There was still an elite that controlled the club, mainly because they looked at it as their own and disrespected the common supporter. Some of them (Filipe Soares Franco for example) were not clever enough to hide that feeling and even expressed in in interviews to newspapers.
The victory of BdC in Sporting was felt like a 25th April revolution in the club. The common people wining over the corrupt and incompetent elites. And it was rightly so. BdC was the hero, a kind of Che Guevara.
What you see as cowardice is basically the fear of the returning to those dates. It is much similar to the fear that existed at a political level for a few years after 1974. The fear of the "reacção", of the old elite coming back to power. At a political level, that fear was than used mainly by the Communist party to strengthen their power. In Sporting this seems to be also used to keep the loyalty to BdC no matter what he does.
Now the big question is whether this fear still has reason to exist or is just artificially sustained in a power struggle. Most of the foristas supporting BdC believe it is still real. And you really cannot blame them considering what was written above. Others are what I call the "ideólogos", and are just manipulating the crowd in favour of BdC.
My personal opinion is that this fear has no justification. SCP maintained it's "old regime" status until the rise of BdC mainly because it was controlled by a group connected and supported by Grupo Espírito Santo. Roquette, Soares Franco, Bettencourt, Godinho Lopes were all very incompetent people who owned their limited success to the protection of Grupo Espírito Santo. The member of GES who was more involved in SCP was Ricciardi, who practically chose among his dependants the Presidents of SCP. The less capable, because they needed the best to work in the group. Ricciardi is obviously a competent person, and we probably owe him the famous financial restructuring . But he had and still has an old vision of the club controlled by elites, his friends.
The fact is that Grupo Espírito Santo exploded after the troika intervention in Portugal. They simply had no money and survived by robbing theirs bank's clients, bribing people including a prime minister and getting into legally dubious businesses.
This means, in my opinion, that the so call croquetes are today a bunch of have beens with no money or power to to anything. They will not win any election and are only useful to BdC to manipulate the sócios on his behalf.

But there is a new factor in this game that I personally have not understood yet: the role of Álvaro Sobrinho. He is no really business man. His money comes from the protection of the Angola nomenclatura end, so is claimed by former GES, from stealing hundreds of millions to them.
He apparently has the money to try to gain power in Sporting. But does he want it ? He lives in Angola, is legally forbidden of travelling to Portugal and has no supporting basis in the club. He probably just wants to make money. But what are his precise intentions is for me still uncertain. He will probably be happy just to take his money out and leave.


 
O fim do clube é um perigo eminente, as rescisões dos jogadores serão uma migalha em comparação com o abandono de sócios e adeptos que não irão sentir qualquer ligação afectiva ao Sporting se deixarem o Sporting ser tomado de assalto.


 :arrow:
Carris Online
Carreira para carnide: 71
Dia 23 isto é, se o JmS não se acobardar, lá estarei. Não me quero sentir responsável por um hipotético regresso dos croquetes.
O CD não pode ir à AG de 23? Isto é verdade? ***, cobardes!
O bombeiro vai ter que inventar outra corrida qq para a frente, pq numa AG destituitiva não se safam, e para o expulsarem de sócio, tb precisam que isso seja ratificado em AG.
E os sócios não vão deixar nem uma coisa nem outra!
E aviso, para que não se façam de parvos, os sócios se perceberem que estão a passar por cima das suas decisões em AG, não vão aceitar. Vai acabar em violencia. Pq o povo é sereno, mas só até um limite! Depois não venham chorar.
Há muito tempo que ando aqui apenas a ler mas regressou um momento difícil e quero transmitir algo.
1) Parece-me que o JMS nunca quererá uma ida a votos. >:D
2) Notem que a principal justificação para a destituição do BdC é a sua responsabilidade no que aconteceu na Academia.  :cartao:
3) MUITO IMPORTANTE - Creio que votar na destituição é dar razão à "justa causa" dos mercenários e votar claramente contra os interesses do SCP. :naughty:
4) CONCLUSÃO - Todos os verdadeiros Sportinguistas, gostem muito, pouco ou nada de BdC, deverão sempre votar contra a destituição. :pray:
SPORTING.
Uma das escassas certezas da minha vida.
Importantissimo tambem à causa seria não haver violencia! So iria dar força as rescisões!
So peço a todos os que não aceitam esta golpada, que se desloquem á assembleia no dia 23 e votem contra de forma civil e educada, e a seguir peçam a demissão pela 2a vez do artista que está a manobrar o golpe. É assim que se deve resolver este problema, já chega de violência que já nos prejudicou que chegue.

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Vamos dar como certa a tese do BdC de que o Sporting está a ser alvo de um ataque concertado. Se assim é, o que quero saber não é de conferências, como a de hoje, contra comentadores desportivos, mas como é que o líder do clube se está a sair desse confronto. E nesse quesito, é só fazer as contas. Os principais jogadores (e ativos financeiros) do clube rescindiram; o empréstimo obrigacionista, neste contexto de casa a arder, parece miragem; fora da champions e tendo de pagar milhões em obrigações para não entrar em default; decisões democráticas do clube numa disputa em tribunal. Um sucesso até aqui, portanto. Ah!, e claro, já me esquecia, o braço direito de BdC, André Geraldes, está proibido, por ordem judicial, de entrar em Alvalade e de exercer qualquer cargo de direção desportiva, e só está em liberdade porque pagou 60 mil euros. Não estou a dizer que é culpado, nem ele nem o clube, apenas que está suspenso por ordem de um tribunal. É o suficiente para ser bastante desagradável.

Eu sou um sportinguista isento, racional e critiquei sempre as atitudes do Presidente Bruno de Carvalho quando achei oportuno se existe utilizador neste fórum que tem autoridade moral para falar neste momento sou eu porque fui atacado várias vezes em forma de bullying por ter uma opinião contrária a esmagadora maioria dos foristas.

Neste momento depois de analisar todos os dados vou votar CONTRA a destituição de Bruno de Carvalho no dia 23 caso venha a acontecer a AG, porquê? Porque é neste momento o melhor para o  Sporting pelo menos a curto prazo, vou votar tendo em conta o momento e não o que eu penso que seja o melhor para o futuro a longo prazo, está na cara o que se está a passar, empresários em conluio com pessoas ligadas ao Sporting (Ricciardi, Sobrinho, Marta Soares) lançaram a cartada das rescisões para fazer cair a direcção, agora estão em pânico porque aconteceu o impensável, a direcção não caiu e não resultou a estratégia delineada, todos ficam a ganhar, Direcção que cai abrindo espaço a alguém que seja facilmente controlado, empresários que vão ganhar o deles por causa de transferências por valores irrisórios de mercado e clube enfraquecido para assim aparecer um investidor com a bandeira de que é a última solução possível para o Sporting ser competitivo.

Tenho a certeza que se esta Direcção cair o Sporting não vai ser defendido como merece na questão das rescisões e como estas rescisões são o maior atentado a minha paixão pelo Sporting e a maneira como via o Desporto até então só posso votar CONTRA a saída do Conselho Directivo para ser feita justiça porque nas actuais circunstâncias é o melhor para o Sporting, no futuro logo se vê, depende do comportamento do Presidente, espero que seja menos grotesco e boçal mas pelos interesses do Sporting passo bem com isso mais 2 anos e meio.
E nesta altura, goste-se ou não do presidente, ache-se ou não que é a solução para um futuro mais distante, é a  única hipótese de não sermos comidos de cebolada. Pelo menos, de garantirmos que vamos à luta.

Está na hora de cerrar fileiras.

Mais tarde poderemos e devemos discutir muita coisa.

Não é que interesse muito mas já o tinha dito, apesar dos nossos arrufos, não esperava outra coisa de ti PHRZ.



Enviado do telele

Um passado que regressa com a forma de futuro.

"Quem, ali do outro lado (Alvalade), tinha definido o ataque ao Benfica como principal instrumento da sua promoção individual, foi corrido pelos que achava serem seus. "
Kadafi, o clemente.
Está a decorrer uma sondagem nesta página e Bruno de Carvalho lidera a votação!
https://www.facebook.com/Sporting-At%C3%A9-Morrer-615560888474850/
O Sporting somos nós!...É nosso outra vez!
Nunca nos renderemos!
Se eu nascesse agora e soubesse o que sei hoje, seria do Sporting outra vez!
So peço a todos os que não aceitam esta golpada, que se desloquem á assembleia no dia 23 e votem contra de forma civil e educada, e a seguir peçam a demissão pela 2a vez do artista que está a manobrar o golpe. É assim que se deve resolver este problema, já chega de violência que já nos prejudicou que chegue.

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Ninguém vai aceitar isto... Mesmo quem não goste de BdC...
Depois numas eleições já percebo ... Aqui mesmo quem não goste dele tem a OBRIGAÇÃO de votar contra a destituição.
A lot of crap because if he loved Sporting he would already have stepped down.  The last month he said so many bullshit that somebody with a just a little bit of IQ doesn't believe him anymore.   Now it's just keeping on so that he can get his monthy income.   From zero to hero and back to zero that is his story at Sporting. Did I see this coming before 2018 no but now this is a reality. He was one of the best presidents until 2018 we had but know he is in contention with godinho Flopes to be one of the worst presidents in our history.  For me he became a Roquete someone who is there for his ego and the financial or other advantages  the presidency gives him.


You can translate my comment better, what you write is your opinion and probably what you see and read on TVs. I do not have that opinion and I do not usually classify people just by appearances, the President only did what he did because the Football team did not meet his demands (and many members of a team that is very well paid), is simple. If you had more inside what is happening in Portugal and in our country maybe you had another idea and position in the matter.
BTW, I do not usually measure a person's IQ just because they support an ideology or not.

Cheers.

I see someone who doesn't accept democratic instances, how could a judge rule that the mother is better for his child then the father;

I see someone who lies a lot of the time; Os socios criam que eu apagava o facebook, where is diana, there is no problem betweem the players and me;

I see someone who tells what people want to hear and excludes what the people don't want to hear; we loaned Jonathan Silva to Rome with a buy clause but he didn't say that the buy clause was optional; 90% voted for him in February, no 90% voted for the change of statutes and probably a lot but surely not 90% voted because they wanted him to stay.

I see someone who can't lead with his staff; how many people of his team left;

I see someone who needs to be in the point of attention; birth of his child, apparently his wedding; the way he talks always eu; the way he celebrates the wins instead of giving the staff and the players their moment of glory.

I see someone who can't deal with failure.

I see someone who doesn't respect anyone because if someone doesn't respect him then he will give him a name. Traidor, Ingrato, Sportinguado, Roquete, ....

I see someone who is too emotional.

I see someone who isn't capable to solve the problems internaly like smart people do or families normally do.

I see someone who is putting himself always in the victim role.


So he is incapable of being a good leader but soon or late this would come out like it did the past months.  Gestao Danosa, living in a fantasy world, disastrous communication and putting his interest above those of Sporting.


People that don't see that are in my opinion :

* idiots;
* idolize him;
* cowards;
* no Sportinguistas;
* or just there for the tacho like those who are still in the CD.

Our president has also good qualities and probably the best one he has is that he could convince people and he did that, he gave us back hope. I don't want someone of the old dinasty but I'm surely don't want him in a role where he can manage the day of day of Sporting.

This is a very good analysis. I agree with it. Thank you.
But let me try to express my opinion about the reasons why many are what you call "cowards". There are profound cultural aspects that you have to take into account.
Many Portuguese still have a trauma, coming from the times of dictatorship, of resignation and mistrust of the elites. They were right to feel that way. Power was controlled by a small group that kept most of the richness to themselves. This group was very closed and common people had very small chances of getting in. Even in the private sector, you only had a chance if accepted by this group (google "condicionamento industrial" for more detail).
Sporting kept this kind of situation after the revolution. It was like a reality that survived the revolution. There was still an elite that controlled the club, mainly because they looked at it as their own and disrespected the common supporter. Some of them (Filipe Soares Franco for example) were not clever enough to hide that feeling and even expressed in in interviews to newspapers.
The victory of BdC in Sporting was felt like a 25th April revolution in the club. The common people wining over the corrupt and incompetent elites. And it was rightly so. BdC was the hero, a kind of Che Guevara.
What you see as cowardice is basically the fear of the returning to those dates. It is much similar to the fear that existed at a political level for a few years after 1974. The fear of the "reacção", of the old elite coming back to power. At a political level, that fear was than used mainly by the Communist party to strengthen their power. In Sporting this seems to be also used to keep the loyalty to BdC no matter what he does.
Now the big question is whether this fear still has reason to exist or is just artificially sustained in a power struggle. Most of the foristas supporting BdC believe it is still real. And you really cannot blame them considering what was written above. Others are what I call the "ideólogos", and are just manipulating the crowd in favour of BdC.
My personal opinion is that this fear has no justification. SCP maintained it's "old regime" status until the rise of BdC mainly because it was controlled by a group connected and supported by Grupo Espírito Santo. Roquette, Soares Franco, Bettencourt, Godinho Lopes were all very incompetent people who owned their limited success to the protection of Grupo Espírito Santo. The member of GES who was more involved in SCP was Ricciardi, who practically chose among his dependants the Presidents of SCP. The less capable, because they needed the best to work in the group. Ricciardi is obviously a competent person, and we probably owe him the famous financial restructuring . But he had and still has an old vision of the club controlled by elites, his friends.
The fact is that Grupo Espírito Santo exploded after the troika intervention in Portugal. They simply had no money and survived by robbing theirs bank's clients, bribing people including a prime minister and getting into legally dubious businesses.
This means, in my opinion, that the so call croquetes are today a bunch of have beens with no money or power to to anything. They will not win any election and are only useful to BdC to manipulate the sócios on his behalf.

But there is a new factor in this game that I personally have not understood yet: the role of Álvaro Sobrinho. He is no really business man. His money comes from the protection of the Angola nomenclatura end, so is claimed by former GES, from stealing hundreds of millions to them.
He apparently has the money to try to gain power in Sporting. But does he want it ? He lives in Angola, is legally forbidden of travelling to Portugal and has no supporting basis in the club. He probably just wants to make money. But what are his precise intentions is for me still uncertain. He will probably be happy just to take his money out and leave.

Thanks for the clarification. Maybe that coward is not the right word and I have to change it by afraid of who the new president would be if our president has to go.

I would sugest that when there will be a AG where the statutes will change that they set a new point in it: that the socios have to be in favour with a majority of 75% if somsebody wants to get a investor in where Sporting would loose the majority of the control.

Mesmo quem não gosta do Bd, sabe o que está em causa, espero eu... Dia 23 lá estarei... Com o meu pai e os meus avós, a votar contra a destituição do CD e bom bom era conseguir correr com o bombeiro!
Pode algum socio ou grupos de socios durante a AG pedir uma votação  para a destituicao do marta soares?
Esforço, Dedicação, Devoção e Gloria.......... CAMPEÕOOOEESSSSS
Há aqui qualquer coisa que não me está a cheirar nada bem.

Se já se percebeu ao que os golpistas vêm e já se viu que quem quer dar a golpada, são os mesmos do antigamente, eles vão deixar que aqueles que são indesejados (os sócios) decidam algo que eles acham que devem usurpar, sem os consultar?

E vamos supor que sim. Vamos supor que eles até querem que todo este processo passe pela Assembleia de dia 23. Ora, se já estamos mais ou menos todos a ver que é muito possível que a destituição de BdC seja chumbada, os golpistas não estão? E vão-se colocar nas mãos do destino, sabendo que as probabilidades de serem derrotados são muito altas?

Nãa!... Isto cheira-me que vem aí qualquer coisa. Não sei o que é, mas... cheira-me.


Completamente de acordo , tanta vontade  de terem poder e depois arriscarem claramente uma derrota, nops!
Isto tem que ter muito mais consistencia, caso contrario e a evidencia da  pura incompetencia que nos esperaria caso conseguissem a golpada...
Os índios também eram vermelhos e f*....
Está a decorrer uma sondagem nesta página e Bruno de Carvalho lidera a votação!
https://www.facebook.com/Sporting-At%C3%A9-Morrer-615560888474850/

Isso vale zero. Quem vai votar sim não anda a fazer votações no facebook. Até excursões vão ser organizadas. Quem arma isto não vai para uma AG submeter-se à vontade dos outros. Leva caryas na manga e tudo planeado.
“A lot of football success is in the mind. You must believe you are the best and then make sure that you are.” - Bill Shankly
Estou convencido que BdC nunca cairá por vontade dos sócios.
(Espero é que havendo AG, não haja esquemas estranhos nos bastidores)
SPORTING ATÉ MORRER